Any competent author seeking to write a history of the PBA Tour would make Gary Mage one of their first calls.

Mage first competed in the 1960s, bowled nearly full-time during the glory years of the 1970s, winning the 1972 Seattle Open for his lone title. But Mage was not just a one-hit wonder: with better performances on TV he could have a far more notable record as a player.

The 74-year-old native of Tacoma, Washington might rank as the third-best left-hander to come out of the Northwest — Hugh Miller has a strong case for No. 2. The best, of course, was Earl Anthony. The two were close friends, with Mage serving as best man at Anthony’s wedding to Susie.

Mage was a proprietor in multiple centers for many years, and helped many in business, including Anthony.

He served on the PBA Executive Board and it was there that he started on the path for which he probably is best known: As the founder in 1979 and only manager the PBA Northwest Region has known prior to his retirement this year, and as West Region manager since 2004 as well.

Mage’s wife Toni is proof that the third time is the charm sometimes, and she is one of the most beloved figures in PBA history.

I’ve known Mage for about 35 years from bowling in PBA tournaments. I made the Midwest Region team for the PBA National Resident Pro Championship about 20 times and he was there every year as Northwest and later West Region manager. There were many nights where we’d have a crew at the craps table at the Sands in Reno, while Gary and Toni were hammering away on a nearby video poker machine, and he'd sometimes add a 2BAD of his own.

The love PBA players and others have for the Mages was shown in the donations that came forth to deliver them a vacation to Hawaii. (Full disclosure: I donated to that effort.)

Mage’s endorsement of Josh Blanchard as his replacement as a Regional Manager makes me fully confident that the West/Northwest is in capable hands.

“It is a privilege to follow in the footsteps of Gary Mage,” Blanchard said in this PBA news release announcing the change. “He isn’t easily replaced, but I hope to continue many of the long-standing events he developed over his tenure. I look forward to working for the bowlers and providing the best events possible for the PBA and its members in the West and Northwest Regions.”

In this Facebook post, PBA Commissioner Tom Clark said that:
“Gary treated the players and host bowling center proprietors and general managers as family.
He also had the full trust and respect of the PBA, and at a critical moment for the national tour in 2010, Gary helped secure a special partnership with South Point Bowling Center to host the PBA World Series of Bowling II. Gary's relationship with South Point general manager Mike Monyak made it possible and it changed the course of bowling history for the better, for the PBA and Las Vegas.”

In a message exchange. Clark explained that before the second World Series “the partner we expected to have to host it, wasn't able to, so we were in a real bind and thought South Point would be a great place for it. … I didn't have a personal relationship with Monyak at that point, but Gary had built up a great amount of trust working with Monyak through the years in the West, so having Gary set up the meeting and having Gary at the first meeting I had with Mike meant immediate trust and ability to work out very difficult logistics and make the event happen in a spectacular fashion, which meant a lot to the PBA and to South Point.”

Those words prompted a simple “wow” from Mage, during a recent interview that stretched past an hour and covered all of the topics above and much more.

As was noted in the comments after this story was posted on Facebook, Mage is a prime candidate for the PBA Hall of Fame now that he is retired.

The bold-faced type is my questions, with Mage’s answers following, with virtually no editing, meaning this is very long. But, as I say when I do a Q&A, hopefully it’s also entertaining and informative.

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So let’s start with the obvious: How has retirement been?

I’ve had a wonderful retirement so far. I got gout. I couldn’t walk around. They couldn’t fix my knee until we get through this COVID thing. We spent Thanksgiving alone staying away from everybody because we’re old and my father-in-law is 90 and lives with us and we have to be careful.

Yes 2020 has been wonderful, hasn’t it? How did you get your start in bowling?

I saw (shows like Championship Bowling at Faetz Niesen in Chicago) on TV and though it was neat. I loved watching those old shows. I started throwing my dad’s bowling ball into the couch and practicing a slide on the kitchen on the floor because I couldn’t afford to bowl. Then I got old enough and my dad took me to the bowling center and I got to keep score to make money to get to bowl.

How did you get to be a Tour level player?

A lot of work. I practiced constantly 365 days a year It was kind of a joke when most guys were dating and stuff like that they gave the nickname, ‘I’d rather bowl.’ That’s all I did was work and bowl.

What was your home center?

Because of my dad’s job we moved to Vancouver, Washington when I was like 13 and I befriended a guy by name of Jack Crosley whose father had Crosley Bowl. And that’s where I began to bowl all the time and work on my skills.

Did you have a coach?

No. I was all self-taught.

How old were you when you felt ready for the Tour?

That was kind of a process. I was throwing a full-roller. I won a spot for the (PBA Tour) national stop in Portland in 1966 and finished either last or next to last and went back to the bowling center that night and bowled till the end of the next day until I could throw a three-quarter roller. It was 12, 14 hours. It wasn’t the best three-quarter roller but it got me there. I decided based on everything I saw … the only guy I saw who scored throwing a full roller was (4-time PBA Tour champion) Gene Rhoda. I really worked hard on it. I bowled an incredible amount. I refined my game so much that I actually had a metronome that they’d put on the ball return and I’d set my feet to the pace of the metronome.

I got my first check in Denver in 1968. I made match play when there were 16 and I was the only lefty. 1970 was when we first went on the Tour. There were four of us in one car and we had a total of five bowling balls and we stayed in Motel 6 when it actually cost $6 to stay a night. The others were Terry Rea, who unfortunately has passed away, Ed Dolfay and, of course, Earl (Anthony).

And this was before Earl was Earl?

The first tournament we bowled was in Wichita, Kansas and he made the TV show.

Didn’t he go out on Tour and then come home and work on his game and then go back out and become a star?

The story is that, but he bowled like three Northwest (PBA Tour) tournaments and that was it. What really put him on the Tour — the only reason he went on the Tour — is because they took his warehouse job and moved him to swing shift and he couldn’t watch his son play sports, so he got mad and quit and got a sponsor and went on Tour. Otherwise he might never have gone on Tour.

This was this was heyday of lefties before they had a lane man, but your title was after Lenny and Sam started the lane maintenance program?

I hated being left-handed, but I also didn’t perform well when all the lefties did. I seemed to do better when the lefties didn’t bowl that well. For example, my first year in 1970 I made the (match play) finals in Kansas City and Toledo and I was the only lefty. I bowled that tournament in San Jose (1971) where all the lefties made the finals (16 of 16) and I did not make the finals. I left there and said I will never bowl the PBA again until they control the left side. And the next time I bowled they were doing the lanes and I won. (Here is Nicholson’s series on the history of lane maintenance I did with him on his Phantom Radio show.)

Was your game different than other lefties or what?

I think my game was different and also my mental aspect was different. When you’re told you have the advantage all the time, it’s kind of hard to stomach. And you take more pride when they say, ‘How did you do that?’ One of my biggest thrills was when I won a big tournament in the Northwest playing the fourth arrow and lefties never played the fourth arrow.

What do you remember about winning the Seattle Open in 1972 (June 2-5 Ballinger Bowl)?

With eight games to go, the proprietor had a party at his house and everybody was congratulating me because I had an insurmountable lead of over 200 pins. We went back to bowl the last eight games and after three games of those eight games I was now in second place. Earl shot 8-something and 300 at me and took the lead. In the position round, I beat Earl like 256-254 to win (this was a tournament without a TV show). (Anthony won the next two weeks for his third and fourth PBA Tour titles — That link is Wikipedia becuse the archives at PBA.com are not up again since the new website went live.)

And you guys already were close friends by then?

Yeah. We traveled together in 1970 and as time went on, he was out there with his family for a few years. But we got closer and closer as time went on. We traveled together a lot and I did a lot of business things with him also.

How long did you bowl full time on Tour?

Full time would be hard to explain because what happened is after I won the tournament in 1972, I actually bought a bowling center that year. So in ’73 I hardly bowled at all. The only thing exciting that happened in ’73 was when I got screwed out of winning a whole bunch of money in a tournament called the Petersen Classic. I bowled like 120 over (Mage later checked and found he had 1,717) and they took me upstairs to a room and said, ‘We can’t let you win. You’re a PBA member. We’ll give you $20,000 and not post your score.’ I said, ‘I’m a studier of statistics and nobody’s ever bowled a score like that, I’ll take my chances.’ And the last week of the tournament they posted a new leader. But I did get second place for like $30,000 and I bought my partner out of the bowling center. (George Wade won the Petersen in 1973 with 1,728. The most recent score higher than that was Buddy Bomar in 1947 with 1,750. The 1,728 was been beaten just three times since with 1,731 twice and 1,733)

Wow. They wanted to not even count your score and give you $20,000 just because you’re a PBA member. I don’t think anyone would think that mattered at the Pete.

Well, back then it paid like $50,000. But that’s what they told me that night. Not only did they only want to pay me that, but they also said I had to give the scorekeepers like $3,000 for keeping score. That’s ridiculous. So when people talk about the Petersen Classic being so tough I tell them I have a lifetime average of 214 there because I never went back. We were headed to New York for the ABC and that was the only time I bowled the Petersen Classic.
I have a couple of good stories like that. In 1972 I went to my first ABC Tournament and I had a good trip and a bad trip at the same time. A flip of the coin probably cost me getting into the USBC Hall of Fame. We had a team and two of us were PBA members so we had to flip a coin for which one of us bowled on the team. The other guy’s name was Darrell Storkson — he won the toss, he bowled on the team, he shot 1,680 all-events and the team won the team all-events for an Eagle (Kenmore & Village Lanes of Seattle with 9,175). I shot 1,984, finished second in the all-events, third in the singles, and had 700 in the team event and got no Eagle because I wasn’t on that team. I kid people that not winning that and three top 5s in the Masters probably kept me out (of the USBC Hall of Fame).

So you were a proprietor from 1973 on?

Correct. I named it Magic Lanes because I wrote a bowling column called Mage’s Magic. It was in the Seattle suburb of Burien.

How much did you bowl on Tour after 1973?

’73 I built the business up. Then after that ’74 through ’79 I pretty much was out there where I either made enough money or bowled enough tournaments to be considered at least a Touring 2. I think the most I ever bowled was 1970 but after that he most was maybe 18 tournaments in a year.

How close did you come to winning again?

That’s another good story. Dick Weber won his last singles title in the King Louie Open in 1977 and he beat me. He beat me throwing an LT-48 with five stars on it. True story. Back then the guys all doctored their bowling balls (to stay with their contracts). So Dick beat me for his last title and then Earl beat me for his last Senior Tour title (the 1997 Tri Cities Senior Open). And neither of them are still here, so in that aspect I guess I’ve been pretty fortunate.

 

And in 1979 you became Northwest Region manager?

Correct. Back then we had a pretty active Executive Board and I was involved on the Executive Board for a number of years. And in 1979 at the Executive Board I complained that there were Regional tournaments on the West Coast but nothing up in the Northwest. And they told me (West Region manager) Ted (Hoffman) had tried to run some tournaments, but didn’t have any luck. I said, ‘I think I can get the Region going,’ so they said, ‘Let’s do a test.’ And I ran two tournaments and they said to go for it. So in 1979 I started being the Northwest Regional Manager. And after the buyout in 2000, I got approached about taking on the entire West Coast. And they ended up giving me the job.

With the Northwest, you probably had about the hardest job in the PBA aside from being the lane man?

Well during all those years we were the lane man, too, at times. We used the spray gun just like Lennie (Nicholson) did. It was interesting. And, of course, back in those days we carried those plastic telescores around that had your names on them. I prided myself that for all my tournaments I did round robins with stepladder finals to teach the guys to get ready to go on the Tour. And, of course, I already had Dave Husted and Marshall Holman and (Brian) Voss came through our program.  

Being manager must have really cut into your bowling?

Yes. At first, they allowed me to bowl (PBA events) if I wanted to. I started out only bowling doubles. I didn’t bowl singles. And then (PBA Southwest Region Manager) Cecil Caddell was bowling everything in Texas so that one year I said, ‘Can I bowl too if I don’t do the lanes?’ And they said OK. So I bowled, qualified (for the 1983 PBA National Resident Pro Championship), made the show and finished third. I think Daryl Bower won the tournament.

 

 

 

 

  

Those were very different times. Did you get grief for bowling, or did people not care back in those days?

I got a little bit of grief. More so from the rest of the country, not the Northwest. So after that (1983) I literally maybe bowled two or three more Regionals until I turned 50. I won a Senior Regional in Al Thompson’s (Central) Region in 1997. That’s when I had a big run. I bowled for the title on the Senior Tour back-to-back weeks and bowled really well.

How many Senior Tour tournaments did you bowl before the tech guys bought the PBA and you weren’t allowed to bowl anymore?

I would guess maybe 35. And I bowled for the title four or five times and won twice. I beat (Pete) Courture and I beat John Handegard for titles. That was probably my greatest understanding of my weakness as a bowler when I beat John Handegard. That was the second tournament I bowled after I turned 50 and I led the tournament. And in the stepladder Handegard went like 270, 260 and I was the leader and he started with the front seven and I did not have a double after five frames. Interesting enough I never thought about losing. And I actually struck out for 259 and beat him 259-257. I realized at that point what Earl had always told me how much the mind is a factor. I have the worst television record ever. One year on the Winter Tour I made three straight shows and I never won. I started out like 0-11 (on TV). I couldn’t beat anybody. I was terrible. My feet got too fast on TV. I kidded people that you could hand me a microphone and I could talk to 50,000 people, but put a bowling ball in my hand and tell me I’m on TV and I’m pretty bad. I finished in the top five in nine majors, never winning one.
I have to share one story. We’re running these PBA Jr tourneys a while ago (over Labor Day weekend) and the young man who was leading, his dad was an outspoken guy. The kid was a 2-handed left-hander playing 5-board whacking ‘em and it’s on the Mike Aulby pattern and his father says to me, ‘My son likes the Mike Aulby pattern. Do you know who Mike Aulby is?’ My response was, ‘Sir. Mike Aulby made his first television show in 1979 in the PBA National Championship at the Showboat and the first game he ever bowled on television was against me. I think I know who Mike Aulby is.’ That’s a true story.

So it’s not unfair to say that if you had been a better player on TV you might have been a pretty big star?

I would have been OK. Disappointed I didn’t win more? No doubt about that. But I also never prioritized strictly the bowling because I was a business person also. So I tried to manipulate a lot of things. Like I said, my biggest disappointment was before I turned 50 I had both knees operated on, got in shape, went out there and was going to try to prove to myself how good I could have been. My first letdown was when this guy called me on the phone who was retired from bowling and said, ‘I hear you’re going to go on the Tour. So I think I’ll come back and bowl with you.’ And his name was Earl. I couldn’t get away from the guy. I really was looking forward to that phase of my life where I thought I had a chance. And I bowled for the title four times in a limited amount of tournaments. But when the new PBA bought us in 2000, I was done. The last tournament I bowled, I led the tournament and Dale Eagle beat me for the title. I always kidded Eagle that he made me quit. With the new owners, we became employees instead of independent contractors and we couldn’t bowl anything at all.

But just imagine if you won even two of those nine majors and totaled half a dozen titles. That’s maybe not a Hall of Fame career, but much different than having one title.

Yeah (and Mage chuckled). I laugh about that because I never talked about my bowling and a number of years ago when Tony Reyes was still alive and I had been in the West (as manager) a couple of years, he asked me to do his charity event. So I put some house shoes on and found a left-handed ball in the lockerroom and went out there and so many of these young guys had no clue I even bowled. And they were taking pictures (and Mage laughed). It’s interesting because I’m a history buff when it comes to bowling — who won what and stuff like that. To me, that is the one disappointing thing about bowling compared to like golf: The golfers have such a respect for history, and unfortunately in bowling I don’t think the respect is here as much as it should be. For example, we just lost Dick Ritger and what a talent he was. I can feel good about the fact that I was able to achieve and win at every level of professional bowling. That part I feel good about.

Aside from your wins, what highlight or two do you have from your years of bowling?

Probably some dumb stuff. How about 1972 when Fred Borden asked me to bowl with this non-member in the Bowlers Journal doubles — Keith was his last name, I think. And he started out with 17 in the second frame and I thought this could be a long day. And when all was said and done, we bowled the first ever 1,400. The guy shot 700-something after 17 in the second frame. (Keith had 740 and Mage 669 for the win with 1,409, according to the Akron Beacon Journal, courtesy of bowling historian Eric Hartman.) The friends and people I got to spend time with and become friends with was the most important thing to me. And that I was able to fortunately do things sometimes to help people out. I actually sponsored Johnny Petraglia on Tour for a while. And, of course, I negotiated and bought Earl’s bowling center for him in 1980. I got Marshall Holman his contract with Nike. Things like that I could take real pride in. I always wanted to be like an agent, but I felt there wasn’t enough of a calling for it.
And a few years ago at the World Series, a man from back East somewhere came up to me and said, ‘Mr. Mage, I want to give you a gift.’ And he gave me my trading card that was made in the early ‘70s and it was PSA graded mint. It was worth probably a quarter (and Mage laughed). But I thought that was quite a wonderful thing.
One of my best stories probably though was Earl and I are standing in the Chicago airport waiting to catch a plane and this young lady comes running toward us. And I said, ‘OK Earl, get ready.’ And this young lady walks right by Earl and says, ‘Mr. Mage can I have your autograph?’ True story (and Mage laughed). That was a shocker. I didn’t get many of those shots — I was Earl’s ball boy, grabbing his ball while he was doing interviews.

What was it that made you and Earl click?

We were total opposites to start with. Earl was an extremely shy, quiet individual. I was more outgoing. I actually did a couple interviews in our motel room on the phone with the people thinking I was Earl because Earl didn’t want to talk — he had trouble talking to people at first. And, of course, as time evolved, he became an incredible announcer. He came out of his shell. Of all the things I remember the most about Earl, was when he went from the crewcut to more hair. Everybody in Tacoma wanted to disown him. He was like the mayor of Tacoma and what happened to him. People actually sent him nasty notes. We related, and only got closer and closer.    

You knew him as well as anyone. What made him so good?

No. 1 obviously for anybody to get to that level, it’s mind No. 1. And persistence No. 2. He had a drive that was incredible. And he never, ever put his shoes on where he didn’t think he’d win that tournament. I think the one thing a lot of people might not know is that he only studied right-handers. He would sit and study and analyze what right-handers did because as you well know, the theory is lefties play 5 to the gutter and never move their feet and how many times was Earl Anthony the only lefty in the finals playing inside? He had that incredible mind. And I tell people about his motivation. One night we were in Texas he came out of a movie theater and there was a batting cage there and he said, ‘You know, I haven’t hit the ball in a while.’ He had been professional baseball player. About two hours later with blisters on his hands he’s hitting every hit. That’s the way he was. He was so driven, whether it was Lenny and him pitching pennies against the wall, or playing ping pong or bowling. He had to win. He was a winner.

When he quit in 1983-84 was he just burned out?

He had to tend to business and things like that. He’d been through the heart attack. He’ made his comeback. The game was beginning to change. I think he’d just had enough at that point. And when he felt he couldn’t believe he was going to win every time he walked out he wasn’t going to bowl.

What did bowling lose when he died so young — relatively young?

Obviously, we lost a great ambassador for bowling. And a wonderful figurehead. I still never really got over it. Susie and I still talk all the time and keep in communication. Anytime you lose an icon like that, or Dick Weber, or Don Carter, it’s a sad thing for the sport. Unfortunately, he and Dick and Don would be remembered so much more if the younger generation realized the incredible talent all these people had. We lost a great human being, a wonderful grandfather, and a guy who loved to play golf and was really good at it.

You also got to enjoy the regional directors. That was quite a crew of guys wasn’t it? (Dick Weber, Harry O’Neale, Ted Hoffman, Al Thompson, Russ Mills, Cecil Caddell and more over the years.)

An interesting group for sure (and Mage laughed). There was always a little battle with who was the most powerful person in the PBA. They all liked that tag. I never fit with them, probably because with the first Resident Pro I took a team to I got on the naughty list right away. They used to do side betting at the Resident Pro. And when I took my first team ever to the Resident Pro and they told me we always do betting. We have doubles teams and you have to have a lefty with a righty and singles and this and that. I said, ‘I got 10 guys here and they’re the 10 best bowlers in this whole tournament, so you can pick anybody you want and I’ll bet all you want to bet.’ Because I’m a gambler. So they took a left-hander who had a limp and a right-hander who had a bad back and they all geared on those two guys. The left-hander was Kevin Krout and the right-hander was Brian Voss and they qualified like 1-3, I won like $8,000 that weekend and that eliminated individual gambling at the Resident Pro. We really had a lot of fun with that stuff. I remember when Dick and did the lanes in Texas. Used a squirt gun. Used a rag. And we messed up because that was the highest scoring at that time.

Did you keep your bowling center and pro shop when you were running a region and then two regions?

After 10 years I built a pretty good business in my bowling center. And my kids were starting to grow up where I wanted to spend a little more time at home and I got an offer to buy my center at a pretty nice price and I decided I would sell. And then unfortunately the next week, my wife filed for divorce. After the divorce was final, I ended up with my two kids and I raised them the next two years. And I could not go back into the bowling business within a couple hundred miles — a non-compete type of thing. And I also couldn’t leave the state because I had my kids. So what ended up happening is I was running a Regional in Spokane and I met a proprietor who said, ‘Hey, I need some help. I need a manager to turn this bowling center around. You got anybody you can recommend?’ I said, ‘Let me think about it.’ And about a week later I called him back and said I’d take the job. So I ended up buying into two centers with the guy. So then I was in Spokane for about 12 years. I had a lease at the one center that was running out and I decided I wanted to get out of the bowling business again. I got a buyer for the one and unfortunately that wife decided to divorce me. That was like 1994. So there I was. My kids were grown up. I was by myself. I was getting ready to turn 50. Had both knees operated on, got in shape and went on the Senior Tour.
Then I was running a Regional in Oregon and saw a young lady who I thought was nice looking. And I knew who she was watching. I knew it wasn’t Kevin Croucher’s wife and I knew it wasn’t his partner’s daughter. So I asked his partner Jerome Lee who the young lady was and he said to ask my niece. And she said, ‘Why?’ And I said, ’I think she’s nice looking.’ And she said to me, ‘How’s your wife?’ And I said, ‘I’m not married,‘ and so she introduced me. So I met Toni and the rest is history — we’ve been together for 24 years. That was 1996.

And Toni has always been with you in the bowling stuff?

She had a very good job working for the Portland Housing Authority. And she was getting to that age over 50 where they didn’t want you to have a great retirement so they started getting rid of the older people. She was let go from the job and the next year I took over the West too, so she traveled with me all the time. And, of course, she absolutely loved. Her story was that she had three boys and now I have 600. These guys when they had personal problems would talk with her. Honestly, she made everything so much better for our Region because she made it such a family atmosphere. For (the NRPC in) Reno, we’d take a whole suitcase of homemade goodies that she had out for everybody all the time. We’ve been able to have a lot of fun with a lot of bowlers from all over the country. She has incredible relationships with Wes Malott, Tommy Jones, Tom Daugherty. They don’t like me because I’m left-handed, but she is OK.     

On the business side of things, you go back to the glory days when bowling was looked at a lot different than it is today. And you saw it all slide. And then the new owners and everything that has happened since to now Bowlero buying the PBA. And you know business. so I’m curious: Do you see any missed opportunities, things that could have been done different that might have changed the course of things for PBA. Or do you think what has happened was pretty much inevitable?

First, a comment about what has happened now. I don’t like politics, but I’m in the worst Democratic part of the country and everything is closed down out here. I begin to realize because I’d be on all these Zoom calls how little respect the bowling industry had. You would have to dig deep to find out what was happening with the restrictions. You could find out about a gym or a bar, but not a bowling center. Sad, sad thing. I think they’ll be some great opportunities for a lot of people because there’s going to be a lot of bowling centers that go broke.
But as far as the PBA goes, I think the biggest mistake they made was when ABC was paying the big dollars. The mistake they made is they tried to create a full-time situation for the bowlers and the employees, which should have never happened. If they would have taken all the ABC money with the sponsorship money and pored it in to only the Winter Tour, the money would have been big. Our Bowler of the Year back in the early ‘70s made more than the No. 1 quarterback in the NFL. But because they spread the money out to the Summer Tour to keep everybody working and because guys wanted to bowl all year because they had sponsors and wanted to get their $800 a week all year long. That to me was one of the mistakes.

So the bigger prize money would have helped the aspirational model?

Correct. Plus it would have been much more attractive to sponsorship. The CEOs that are all golfers might have gotten more involved. As good as Earl was at that time, if he could have done what Tiger Woods did for golf. Bowling has gotten a little overlooked, but back in the ‘70s we were the biggest show on television. There’s no doubt about that.
And the lack of understanding. Think about this. When we watch the U.S. Open in golf we understand how tough that really is. Bowlers bowling league don’t realize how tough the lanes are at the U.S. Open in bowling. They think they’re all 230 average bowlers. The misconception there I believe has really hurt us in people not appreciating the real talent these people have who win, how really, really good they are and how many things they can do.
Bowling has been a wonderful, wonderful life for me. I’ve got to meet absolutely a lot of incredible people. I’ve had some great experiences. I’m disappointed in the fact that I kept hanging on, hoping that someday we could get back to the glory years again. I’m hoping that Bowlero can make this happen. I will say the young lady that I would have been answering to was as nice a person as I’ve ever met and I think she is going to be absolutely great for the PBA. It’s a lady named Michelle Terrell (Bowlero senior director of leagues and PBA).

That’s good to hear. Let’s get to your retiring and how you finally made that decision.

My goal all along was I never wanted to leave till I felt like the right person was there to take my place. When you have spent 40 years of your life with something you get pretty attached. These guys have never had anyone else run a PBA tournament in the Northwest. And things were able to work with out and I felt like to was the right move to make. Unfortunately with the COVID, I didn’t get to go out the way I wanted to go out. I had always promised myself that the last tournament I ran would be Earl’s tournament. But everything got canceled and changed around. And I figured we were really gambling when I was out there for six straight months running all of these tournaments being as vulnerable as I am at 74 years old and having two massive heart attacks. I had to be careful and knock on wood I never had a report of anybody at any of our Regional tournaments getting the COVID.

So you were involved in bringing Josh on?

Yes. Very involved. Like I said, I never believed a regular employee could dictate to a company how they wanted it to be. But I also felt that with the time I had in there I had to be comfortable that I believed that the person that was going to take my spot was the right choice. Josh and his family and us are extremely close. All three of his kids call us grandpa and grandma. We spend a considerable amount of time in Arizona with them. I’m pretty honest on my evaluation of bowling and I think I understand it to a certain level, and I told Josh over and over that, ‘I feel sorry for you, Josh. If you bowled when I bowled you would have been a superstar. You have an absolutely incredible game, but it’s not the game for today’s bowling. You’re in the middle. You’re never going to make it big. Maybe you can hang on, but that’s not what you want in life when you’ve got a wife and three young kids. You’ve got a great education. You’re a wonderful business person. You started five pro shops. Would you ever think about doing my job?’ We went back and forth. And I actually had Aimee come to a couple tournaments to help us. The paperwork became really tough. In two days, I’d have to run 80 credit cards. It wasn’t really the thought process at first, but as time went on and Josh took a look at it, he said, ‘Yeah, you’re right.’ One thing I dislike with that the PBA has done over the last number of years is they give all the money to a very few people. Josh thought he could be one of those people. I made a comment to (PBA Senior Tour and Regional Tour manager) John (Weber) that I thought I had a guy that might be willing to take my place and John liked (Josh) right away. And one thing led to another and when they came to an agreement I gave them notice. Josh cares so much about bowling and the bowlers.

When the tech guys bought PBA and Steve Miller took over I remember thinking maybe we had a chance because they had a plan and ties and all that. And when they weren’t able to do it I became so pessimistic, thinking nothing could ever do it. Now suddenly I have some hope again with Bowlero. Obviously COVID-19 ruined the momentum. But if they can restart it … do you feel good about the potential with Bowlero?

Yeah I do. The problem that happened with Steve Miller and that group is we went from a small group of people to trying to be big time. Downtown Seattle. A staff of 50 people. Spending thousands and millions dollars in my opinion not the correct way, and then put us under the gun. Now we have the (Players Championship) they just announced. We’re talking a million dollars and a quarter-million for first. Anybody that can still bowl that’s any good should think about the fact that the High Roller is gone, everything else is gone, it’s time to think about taking at shot at this. They’ve got other things in the works too. They’re willing to put the money up and make it happen. As big as they are with 300 bowling centers I would think they have some clout that maybe they can make these things happen. And I would hope they would. I think it’s great that Jason Belmonte makes a half-a-million dollars a year. But more importantly I would like to see the guy in 10^th or 15^th place make a half-a-million dollars a year. I would like to see these guys get reward, because the skill level to be at that level is as tough as it is in golf or any other sport. 

So you believe Bowlero can bring PBA back closer to the glory days?

I think they’ve got a chance. I just want to to see the bowling industry come back after we get through what’s going on here (with COVID-19). It’s the saddest thing in the world: Bowling centers are closed. Then they tell them they can open. Then seven days later they close them again. It’s a sad state of affairs.

I know one thing hurting PBA regionals is that at least in my area there are a lot of good non-PBA tournaments and people don’t have to get a card and suffer all the status problems with USBC. I know you have some feelings about that.  

To me one of the saddest things is in the bowling industry is that bowling proprietors have never worked well together, USBC has never worked well together, and a great example is to penalize people for being a PBA member when it comes to USBC. To me that’s totally wrong. The greatest example is when Pete McCordic’s kids wanted to join PBA and Pete cannot bowl in PBA tournaments but they keep us as members. I told him to apply to USBC for a waiver. He’s only a member because they’re paying it — he can’t bowl anything. That is so unfair. Joe Bowl who wants to be a PBA member and has a little pro shop and has never won anything in his life can’t go bowl with his buddy because he’s a PBA member too. I’ve always been against that rule. I can’t bowl because I’ve won (a PBA Tour title)? Fine. I have no problem with that. But you shouldn’t penalize these other people. I’ve always felt bad about that.